American Intervention

[razorblade]

[glow=purple,2,300]Do you think that the USA has any right to intervine in countries (I.E. Iraq) When there is no immidate threat to the US?

I feel that they have no right to enter another country preemptively. By doing so, their opening the door for other countries to be able to invade, and then say "Well, they could have been a threat in the future." [/glow]

[Captain Z]

[glow=black,2,300]
Now there are countries that the Americans, along with other aiding countries were completely right to intervine. For example, Afghanistan and Somalia. Afghanistan was a country which its goverment had been overthrown by militia warriors. Laws and rules were layed out by them, without consent from the people, or UN. Human rights was a definite issue here. Woman had no rights, and were disregarded and mistreated completely.

Somalia, was civil war. Groups of Geurilla soldiers were attempting to fight to control the lands. A typical war. Until militia leaders began seizing aid attempts straight from the ports. All food, water, and human aid resources were stripped from the people. People began to die, and people began to turn on each other, fighting struggling to survive. over 10,000 people were dead before the war was over. This wasnt civil war anymore, it was genocide.

Now a country like Iraq. You know, sometimes you wonder why they even entered that country.

Iraq, you used as an example. America's focus reason for entering that country was to search and destroy any biological threat, such as weapons of mass destruction. The UN (United Nations) only allowed this providing that America presented to the UN that there actually is evidence of traces of biological weapons. UN also sent in a team to search and grade the material presented to them by the United States. What did they find? Nothing. Nothing but empty warhead containers that were left behind from the Gulf War and The Soviet invasion of Iraq. The US also told the UN that Iraq was capable of sending a biological weapon into aerospace in under one hour after givin the order. With what? No one found any material that was weapons grade after a thorough check by the UN team. All the evidence was fabriqated. Yet, look what happend.

America is said to be the most powerful nation in the world. This is why the americans are occupying Iraq. Because everyone thinks they have this massive army, that can smite the next best country like an ant.

What I think? What big army? America has allocated hundreds of billions of dollars to developing an army and year. To constantly increase the size of the army. Where do you get hundreds of billions of dollars? Even George Bush doesnt know. They dont have this kind of money, and now, America is running the largest deficit in entire world history. The way its headed, America, in 25 years, will become the same economy of what Russia had and the turn of the millenium. Russia is a newly democratic country, that is struggling to hold its self together.

So then, now you have Mr.World Supremist, aka Mr.Bush, depriving the earth of all its resources, so he can come home to dinner and say, "Look dear, I am the worlds most powerful man." So then, this brings me back to Iraq. What does the middle east have that Bush needs? Oil. Seen the gas prices lately? They are the highest in history. He took over the oil industry there so he can send funds back to the USA. You hear about all the "Recontruction" that is suppose to be happening, millions of dollars being sent to Iraq to reform the country. All the reforming being done, is done by the United States, supporting only the American economy. "Give me that lollypop, I'll give it back, dont worry."

In the end, America is just a big schoolyard bully. Yeah, you heard it, I said it. I know theres alot of americans here, but you know its true. America has the most weapons of mass destruction anyways, why enter another country to take the little empty warheads away? So Mr.Bush could say "Look dear, I'm the world's most powerful man". Why not worry about Korea, why not worry about France, Britian, Pakistan, Iran. No, Iraq has oil. Lets hit them. Big bullys. They intervine with what they want, and no one will stop them. Ha, just you wait America. [/glow]

[Winged Arrow]

[glow=teal,2,300]Woah woah woah...Hold on a sec there Ziev. First off, yes I agree with you ON SOME PARTS that America isn't the nicest country in the world. Yes, we invaded Iraq and those countries, but it wasn't like we didn't do it unprovoked. I'm not saying it was right, but the fact that September 11th devastated the United States and we lost soo many people in an act of Terrorism, gives us a bit of leway in invading any and all who might try to do that to us again. Sorry, but if your little sister was pushed down, you'd protect her wouldn't you? You'd follow the jerk who pushed her and make sure he paid, wouldn't you? I mean, I know Bush isn't the best president, cause he's not, but if he hadn't done anything at all, and just allowed 9/11 to happen, basically just picked up his sister and walked away, that trust factor in his leadership wouldn't be there. You call us big bullies, but we're not the ones who murdered over 3000 innocent people.

I'm not saying, that because President Bush is in Iraq for the oil is good, because that's definatly not true/right, but I'm glad he's got forces over there. It makes me feel safer, knowing our army is there, pretty much protecting us here at home from any more attacks like 9/11. I understand and respect your points Ziev, though I disaggree with them whole heartedly. President George W. Bush has my full support and respect, and it bugs me when people are ignorant and try to make it seem like he's the big bully on campus when he probably can't even spell campus....

But, I look at our country as the "little Sister" and the president with his armies as the "Big Brother". I feel safer as a little sister, watching my big brother go out and make sure that I'm not hurt again. It makes me proud knowing that the bully who pushed me down, is getting his just deserts from my big brother's friends. As simple and naive as that sounds, it's really nice to think of America that way.

*sigh* Alright, now go ahead and yell at my naive-ness, because I know after I post this, people will tell me I'm stupid, idiotic, naive, moronic, dumb and childish for stating what I believe...*puts her sheild up* Lemme have it.....-.-' [/glow]

[Moose]

I have a somewhat controversial view on the Iraq issue. So if this post makes you hot-headed I encourage you take a while to cool off before replying.

I support the war in Iraq primarily for the oil. Oil is essential to the American and indeed the global way of life. Please be aware that oil not only powers our homes and fuels or cars, but it is used in the production of a majority of items in your home. Look around the room you're sitting in at this very moment; almost all of the things you see are made with oil or had it involved in their production.

What I despise is how Bush invaded Iraq so he could use th oil for his own greedy and ultimately captitalistic purposes. We are sitting on one of the world's largest oil reserves; gas should not be over three dollars per gallon.

[magic]

I agree with Arrow. We're not just big campus bullies, and whether or not Bush can spell it is another matter entirely.

What we were told is that the war in Iraq was a quote: war on terrorism :unquote. True, we were devistated after 9/11, the world trade center was one of our biggest coorperations. Not only that, but the pentagon, one of our main military headquarters. We're also lucky that one of the planes was fought for by the passengers (I found that to be amazing and I respect every one who died on that day for more than one reason).

So as you can see, though we all have different views I can honestly hope that we don't start this big fight and end up ruining this debate. So let's try and keep it a little friendly. ^^U

Anyway, as I said I am completely and 150% with Winged Arrow's view. US is like a little sister, and the army is like the big brother. I'd much rather be fighting back with everything I can than just sit back and wait for the next attact to kill another 3000 plus people. Even though the 'war on terrorism' can never be completed, I'm glad that we are fighting back. Of course if you hadn't noticed there's still a lot of bombs (car bombs, ect.) going off. This means that more of our soldiers are getting killed, and more are being sent in. So here's my other side: I really would like to have our boys back in the country again, and I'd rather not see another 'Arlington' song being played on TV or hear it on the radio. To put it bluntly, I'm not only tired of hearing about Iraq, but I'm tired of all this chaotic death and destruction.

[Captain Z]

[glow=black,2,300]

Alright, Yes, you've done well with your arguement, and i can see somewhat what point your bringing across, but, I still disagree, and will continue to disagree.

Can you really associate, the country of Iraq, with the events on 9/11?

9/11, and the attacks on Spain, Indonesia, and London, were supposible commited by terror cells loyal to the same people who ran the facist government of Afghanistan, which was complete terror for the Afghan citizens. To see what those people, especially woman, what they have been through, can be compared and contrasted with the same lack of rights that took place revoulutions ago. To us, we are very fortunate, most of us that is, to live in countries like America, Canada, and Britain, but you must also believe that things like discrimination is still a true, harsh reality in not one, but many parts of the world. America, and its allied forces (Canada, Britain, Australia, etc, etc) were absoulutely right to liberate these people. The regime that collapsed in this country, was the same one that critisized harshley countries like America and Britain. That their direct intentions were to attack the people of these nations. I do believe that these were the people behind the deaths of 9/11.

But I seriously can not make the connection, on why Iraq, is involved with such terror against America. He has done bad things in the past, but he also has done good things for his nation, and he has also respected and protected his people in the time of the soviet invasions, do not forget that. He may have something against the ways of Americans, but that is an opinion, not a fact, and to act with brutal force, of sending an army to Iraq to overthrow the government, to me, can be easily contrasted, with a common american celebrity, being attacked by the media, for the most normal things of life, especially opinions.

To feel safe at home, yes, this is different. Canada, for example. We do have our army split into different parts of the world, although the stories may not meet the headline of your newspaper. Bosnia, Somalia, West Indies. Our army is there, but this is for a complete different purpose. The homes canadians are, what I believe, are almost 100% safe from the direct threat of a nation. The wars Canadians are fighting no longer are for keeping their shorelines for swimming, but for keeping the shorelines of other nations open for them to swim. They believe that each and every nation should have decent individual rights, to make an honest, fair living. To liberate absoulute power, and turn it into a people's democracy, for all to share. We have not fought a war at arms to protect our own borders since I believe, in 1814. One hundred and ninety one years. And since then, I dont think anyone has felt a direct threat, to their personal safety.

Now Bush on the other hand. What I really dont like seeing, are people rising to powers, because of who their parents are, or who they are related too. Why cant the residents and citizens of a country, have an equal opportunity to be a president? To campaign with and agaisnt public opinion? Maybe this is a bit prejudice, but I really think that Bush had a better chance of being a president, because his father was a president. If Bush had been in a low income family, living in a small village in america, do you think he would have had an equal opportunity? Why are we never seeing any coloured leaders of our multicultural nations either? Do they have a fair chance too? I heard this quote from a movie once, and I believe it is sooo true. I forget the movie, but it stared Chris Rock, running for president of the united states. Dont get me wrong that chris is an indeed a funny person, but he is also a strong speaker.

"You can't stop poverty, if you've never been broke." Now theres a start. Why not let the lower class have a shot in making this country easier for people who are struggling? [/glow]

[okamiwolf]

Now that I can agree with. Thankfully we can I be sure that Bush won't return at next ellection. But hey, why haven't any girls run for president? I believe that it would be good, because we girls are just as good as boys with politics. I know from my government class. -.-U And why don't we have any colored presidents or poor predidents? It's written in the US constitution, but if you can understand all that crap about equal rights (when students have slim to none, not only that but people who have little don't have much rights either) then you're about ten or twelve steps ahead of me. But this topic I can safely sink my teeth into without sounding too stupid.

Anyway, back to the other part which I will probably make a fool of myself with is that I don't know whats going on. No one really does. Because we don't get all the facts. Even news casters don't give everthing, and if you ask me we're all being bias. That's not exactally fair, but it's very true. If you look at a pop star getting called a slut (I won't name names) and then they retaliate by writing a song or something along the lines of that to prove that they aren't and make people think they are? Well, that's nothing like a war. People aren't suffering (like bodily injuries), peole aren't dying, and there aren't any really major sacrifices. I mean sometimes I find that the celebraties are just our comedy relief so that we can laugh and feel comfortable about what we're doing. I'm not saying that America is the best, because by far when I'm old enough I am so out of here, but I'm not saying that we're the absolute worse either.

Okay, feel free to bark at me.

[Sudak]

I know this thread is kinda dead now but this kind of relates to now.

First off replying to the previosu post here.. you women can run for president.. there's nothing holding you back. it's just a matter of whether or not anybody would vote for you.

Second.. I'm all for the invasion of Iraq! Whether it had anything to do with 9/11.. who cares! They've been terrorising the middle east for way to long and now Sadaam has to pay. Yes there are Alqueda there too.. so technically there is a reason to invade due to 9/11. What the freak does it matter now anyways.. We're there.. Sadaam is dead.. and now if we pull out I can gurantee you something would come back to US and bite us in the butt for leaving. We have to settle peace before we leave. Let the military do its job. If you're not going to go over and help make peace then shut it. I know for a fact that every marine, air force, or whatever branch of military serviceman I've talked to has been proud to serve if not wanted wholeheartedly to head over there and do his or her duty. Now there's that Hawaiin guy that is going to court for refusing to go. I say heck dude. you join the military to go over then refuse.. fine you're going to jail.. plain and simple. I'm from a military family and my father was to head over there many times. I supported him 100% though I knew his life was in danger. So yes to stop my rant here. If you're not going to go over and help solve the problem then zip it. Plain and Simple!